It is their responsibility to protect their patients. The information was there for them to find if they wanted to. All of us found it. Why didn’t they? Because they didn’t care to do the research.
It is their responsibility to protect their patients. The information was there for them to find if they wanted to. All of us found it. Why didn’t they? Because they didn’t care to do the research.
Most of them were almost certainly not evil when this started, but they participated in evil and in my opinion they will in no way be able to plead ignorance when the time for pleading comes, which it will. Not a chance. They are MDs and medical professionals. They got where they are by knowing the right answer when others didn’t. If you sell your soul to the devil, which is what knowing compliance in this ongoing crime against humanity amounts to, and you don’t stop, you don’t repent, well, you just might have become evil. You are treading in very dangerous waters.
Thanks for helping me come to terms with this discussion. Veils of individualized “circumstantial” innocence can only wear so thin—moral duty is about honest diligence and curiosity, as opposed to dogma. There comes a “no excuses” time for each & all of us.
You are saying they should be questioning. Well maybe they just aren't built like that, maybe they were trained NOT to be like that.
Some are culpable, yes, but for many of the asleep, if God looks into their hearts on judgement day and sees innocent compliance in their own death and that of others, how will he judge?
We're blaming the asleep because we are not, so 'everyone should know'. The Jonestown folk should have known, is it their fault they died?
Its the feeling they have it coming that bothers me. The victim of lifelong brainwashing blamed for being brainwashed. And therefore beyond redemption?
Questions of Redemption, absolute & relative good and evil are important and interesting…but don’t cut to the issue at hand—How do we stop this? Now isn’t the time for plausible deniability, explanations, or excuses.
And yes, to an extent, “blame” as well. I’m not looking to crucify each and every rank and file collaborator. The big fish to legally fry are in the open and mostly known. That is one key. The other key is, of course, “awareness”.
A comment without judgment: Those who aren't "built to question" will not survive, nor will those around them. In recent millennia we've relied on the benevolent analysis by fellow citizens for solutions to new problems. Many have stopped thinking. That's no longer a viable way forward.
You put the key in what you said "knowing compliance".
Thats my point - why would they know? They were trained to follow protocols, an advanced degree now is not what it was, upon a time. Do they know and why would they know?
It is so very easy for us redpilled to marvel how folk 'fail to comprehend what is right in front of them'. I argue that that failure does not make them evil, it just makes them different.
I only belong to the redpilled because I was challenged to be objective about 911. It took 2 years of making it a hobby before I realized, could internalize, what actually went on. With that came the realization that folk directly involved were so compartmentalized they did not even see it themselves. Anyways I was primed to disbelieve covid. But it took me two years to come to it to that place.
Brainwashing, and a whole life spent believing 'more or less' what MSM says, and training that suggests you just follow protocol.... well thats a hard place to be, and a long way to the light. They jabbed themselves and their families and are lining up to do it again. Think about that. Pity the brainwashed, and offer them support if they come to the light.
The "brainwashing" was going on when my Mom was a student nurse in the late '30s, and when I was in the late '60s, yet we both learned to see and question it. We aren't either 1 anything special; anyone with a modicum of intelligence, which medicine requires, can do it, IF he chooses to!
Its an evil act, yes. Are they then evil, in themselves?
I guess I ponder WHY they would investigate anything. If you're a normie the world is pretty simple. You've never been exposed, at any point, to ANY alternative view. You have NO IDEA what you have no idea about. The entire world, as you see it, is united in 'safe and effective'. Your entire worldview starts with a general trust in 'the system', in authority. And in your personal experience maybe you never saw anything to shake that. My point about 8 different syndromes spaced over 2 years and only 5% of your patients.
Its like you're taking a hobbit and blaming them for not believing in dragons. Or something. Brainwashed Jonestown folk culpable in their own deaths - 'they should have known'.
In your view these folk are in themselves evil. And probably beyond redemption. Would you offer it to them? If they 'partially' woke up?
EDIT - why am I arguing this? Its the redemption thing. And how we view the 'asleep', the normies. Is it disgust they are where they are, taking shot after shot? These docs jabbed themselves and their families. They are to be pitied. They can be redeemed.
Very good discussion......so many 'educated qualified' people simply don't believe there could be such evil afoot, maybe they aren't that clever, a little bit lazy, doing well, lifelong beneficaries of the system, complacent, so they happy to be OK with plausible explanations...it takes a mentally strong person to brush off the last 3 years of mainstream propaganda and normie thought, mandates and nudging. I gave up my telly over 10 years ago and it took 5 years to clear my brain of the garbage. Evil prospers when good people do nothing....we must be reaching some tipping point....but no, plenty of people are in a parallel universe where they avoid any contra-signals. Prof Susan Mitchie of Sage (UK) still promotes the vax etc, and doesn't allow any uninvited Twitter comment. A tax payer funded professor of behavioral change and nudging, who is a total authoritarian and 100% censor - I view that as evil, given present consequences, but I don't know what is going on in her brain. Is she evil, has she sold her soul, or does she believe what she is doing is good and correct? One friend said twitter is toxic... a large element of that opinion is from having to use ones own brain to assess conflicting information and comments, and just ignore abuse...some people can''t handle free speech...critical thinking isn't a common skill. This is just a big ugly game of survival now. There is so much over the last 25 years from the same story book - decades of false narratives may be impossible for people to dismantle mentally. 'In the field of psychology, cognitive dissonance is the perception of contradictory information and the mental toll of it'
Like I need an excuse for trying to work out ways to deprogram normies? Or what is your point.
Stupid approaches to the problems we face, like thinking and speaking ill of brainwash victims, must have the real vampire squids squirming with delight.
"probably for yourself" is personal and uncalled for. I probably have more radical beliefs than 90% of those here. This has nothing to do with me.
And we're back to this 'they should have known'. Like a brainwashed person 'should have known' and not offed themselves and their kids at Jonestown. Its their fault.
I just dont think blaming victims is good policy when to me the only thing that matters is waking up normies before it is too late.
Of course some know, and are culpable. People are so very certain it is 'most know and are culpable'. I dont buy that. I spend all my time trying to deprogram people, it is impossible near.
EDIT My sister is an RN. She is a good kindly person. There is no malice in her. She is fairly smart, and quite well read. And she is entirely immersed in the matrix of the medical establishment. She is in process of jabbing herself and her children to death, and no approach works. I see a victim when I look at her, and I hate the vampire squids ever more as the days pass. My anger grows.
They are not victims, when they make a choice to act. Most of those folks chose 1st to not heed warnings issued by fiends and family, even questions about Jones swirling in the media before the moves 1st to CA, then Guyana. Then they chose to drink poisoned Kool-aid and force it onto their children, KNOWING the intent was to kill them; they had run numerous drills, and were told that time was not a drill. There was information presented, just as there was about the covid policies and jabs. A CHILD can be excused, but not adults. It just doesn't work that way.
Do not put words in my mouth! I said the adults were not victims, because they chose to believe Jones' lies over evidence thereof. Once they got to Guyana, there was the same sort of mass formation psychosis we saw in the USSR,Nazi Germany, and Mao's China, as well as here over the past few yrs, but in all those places here WERE some, subjected to the SAME conditioning and rhetoric, who still saw through it and stood against it. They CHOSE to not heed it, while the rest chose to follow like lemmings. But we are not lemmings: WE have the choice.
Brainwashed people specifically can no longer make choices. Your position is that there were no adult Jonestown victims, they all had choice. I say they did not have choice. I maintain brainwashing and cult programming is a thing, and there but for some luck might be me.
Deprogramming is almost impossible. However as I said we are going in circles.
There is no "brain washing"; your brains like a computer; you can hit delete, but it's not really gone; neither is the neural pathway in a brain. You can lay in new pathways, but no guarantee the old ones won't crop back up, in fact the probability is that they will, creating cognitive dissonance, a very psychologically uncomfortable situation, that's near impossible to ignore. Propagandizing only creates new pathways, which may, for a time, suppress the old pathways, but that's all. Deprogramming is a bit like trying to convince you that free will trumps the propaganda: 1has to want to let go the new pathways and rediscover the old ones or create different new ones to replace both. That's what psychotherapy is all about. It only works when you want t to, but that's true of propaganda too.
It is their responsibility to protect their patients. The information was there for them to find if they wanted to. All of us found it. Why didn’t they? Because they didn’t care to do the research.
Well its a view. Are they evil?
Most of them were almost certainly not evil when this started, but they participated in evil and in my opinion they will in no way be able to plead ignorance when the time for pleading comes, which it will. Not a chance. They are MDs and medical professionals. They got where they are by knowing the right answer when others didn’t. If you sell your soul to the devil, which is what knowing compliance in this ongoing crime against humanity amounts to, and you don’t stop, you don’t repent, well, you just might have become evil. You are treading in very dangerous waters.
Thanks for helping me come to terms with this discussion. Veils of individualized “circumstantial” innocence can only wear so thin—moral duty is about honest diligence and curiosity, as opposed to dogma. There comes a “no excuses” time for each & all of us.
You are saying they should be questioning. Well maybe they just aren't built like that, maybe they were trained NOT to be like that.
Some are culpable, yes, but for many of the asleep, if God looks into their hearts on judgement day and sees innocent compliance in their own death and that of others, how will he judge?
We're blaming the asleep because we are not, so 'everyone should know'. The Jonestown folk should have known, is it their fault they died?
Its the feeling they have it coming that bothers me. The victim of lifelong brainwashing blamed for being brainwashed. And therefore beyond redemption?
Questions of Redemption, absolute & relative good and evil are important and interesting…but don’t cut to the issue at hand—How do we stop this? Now isn’t the time for plausible deniability, explanations, or excuses.
Well in simple terms blaming victims is a waste of time and beyond that harmful.
Agree with your post below, the real vampire squids and those who are in and of themselves evil are the ones we need to go after.
And yes, to an extent, “blame” as well. I’m not looking to crucify each and every rank and file collaborator. The big fish to legally fry are in the open and mostly known. That is one key. The other key is, of course, “awareness”.
A comment without judgment: Those who aren't "built to question" will not survive, nor will those around them. In recent millennia we've relied on the benevolent analysis by fellow citizens for solutions to new problems. Many have stopped thinking. That's no longer a viable way forward.
God doesn't grade on a curve. They cannot claim innocence.
You put the key in what you said "knowing compliance".
Thats my point - why would they know? They were trained to follow protocols, an advanced degree now is not what it was, upon a time. Do they know and why would they know?
It is so very easy for us redpilled to marvel how folk 'fail to comprehend what is right in front of them'. I argue that that failure does not make them evil, it just makes them different.
I only belong to the redpilled because I was challenged to be objective about 911. It took 2 years of making it a hobby before I realized, could internalize, what actually went on. With that came the realization that folk directly involved were so compartmentalized they did not even see it themselves. Anyways I was primed to disbelieve covid. But it took me two years to come to it to that place.
Brainwashing, and a whole life spent believing 'more or less' what MSM says, and training that suggests you just follow protocol.... well thats a hard place to be, and a long way to the light. They jabbed themselves and their families and are lining up to do it again. Think about that. Pity the brainwashed, and offer them support if they come to the light.
The "brainwashing" was going on when my Mom was a student nurse in the late '30s, and when I was in the late '60s, yet we both learned to see and question it. We aren't either 1 anything special; anyone with a modicum of intelligence, which medicine requires, can do it, IF he chooses to!
If they don’t protect their patients then yes that is evil.
Especially when they choose to put job/career ahead of human life!
The “new” protocols (that didn’t make medical sense and involved bribes) should have raised more eyebrows.
One would think so.
Its an evil act, yes. Are they then evil, in themselves?
I guess I ponder WHY they would investigate anything. If you're a normie the world is pretty simple. You've never been exposed, at any point, to ANY alternative view. You have NO IDEA what you have no idea about. The entire world, as you see it, is united in 'safe and effective'. Your entire worldview starts with a general trust in 'the system', in authority. And in your personal experience maybe you never saw anything to shake that. My point about 8 different syndromes spaced over 2 years and only 5% of your patients.
Its like you're taking a hobbit and blaming them for not believing in dragons. Or something. Brainwashed Jonestown folk culpable in their own deaths - 'they should have known'.
In your view these folk are in themselves evil. And probably beyond redemption. Would you offer it to them? If they 'partially' woke up?
EDIT - why am I arguing this? Its the redemption thing. And how we view the 'asleep', the normies. Is it disgust they are where they are, taking shot after shot? These docs jabbed themselves and their families. They are to be pitied. They can be redeemed.
Very good discussion......so many 'educated qualified' people simply don't believe there could be such evil afoot, maybe they aren't that clever, a little bit lazy, doing well, lifelong beneficaries of the system, complacent, so they happy to be OK with plausible explanations...it takes a mentally strong person to brush off the last 3 years of mainstream propaganda and normie thought, mandates and nudging. I gave up my telly over 10 years ago and it took 5 years to clear my brain of the garbage. Evil prospers when good people do nothing....we must be reaching some tipping point....but no, plenty of people are in a parallel universe where they avoid any contra-signals. Prof Susan Mitchie of Sage (UK) still promotes the vax etc, and doesn't allow any uninvited Twitter comment. A tax payer funded professor of behavioral change and nudging, who is a total authoritarian and 100% censor - I view that as evil, given present consequences, but I don't know what is going on in her brain. Is she evil, has she sold her soul, or does she believe what she is doing is good and correct? One friend said twitter is toxic... a large element of that opinion is from having to use ones own brain to assess conflicting information and comments, and just ignore abuse...some people can''t handle free speech...critical thinking isn't a common skill. This is just a big ugly game of survival now. There is so much over the last 25 years from the same story book - decades of false narratives may be impossible for people to dismantle mentally. 'In the field of psychology, cognitive dissonance is the perception of contradictory information and the mental toll of it'
I think you're looking for an excuse that simply doesn't exist, probably for yourself, certainly for people who don't deserve it.
That’s exactly what he’s looking for. Any kind of excuse.
Who is 'he'?
Like I need an excuse for trying to work out ways to deprogram normies? Or what is your point.
Stupid approaches to the problems we face, like thinking and speaking ill of brainwash victims, must have the real vampire squids squirming with delight.
"probably for yourself" is personal and uncalled for. I probably have more radical beliefs than 90% of those here. This has nothing to do with me.
And we're back to this 'they should have known'. Like a brainwashed person 'should have known' and not offed themselves and their kids at Jonestown. Its their fault.
I just dont think blaming victims is good policy when to me the only thing that matters is waking up normies before it is too late.
Of course some know, and are culpable. People are so very certain it is 'most know and are culpable'. I dont buy that. I spend all my time trying to deprogram people, it is impossible near.
EDIT My sister is an RN. She is a good kindly person. There is no malice in her. She is fairly smart, and quite well read. And she is entirely immersed in the matrix of the medical establishment. She is in process of jabbing herself and her children to death, and no approach works. I see a victim when I look at her, and I hate the vampire squids ever more as the days pass. My anger grows.
They are not victims, when they make a choice to act. Most of those folks chose 1st to not heed warnings issued by fiends and family, even questions about Jones swirling in the media before the moves 1st to CA, then Guyana. Then they chose to drink poisoned Kool-aid and force it onto their children, KNOWING the intent was to kill them; they had run numerous drills, and were told that time was not a drill. There was information presented, just as there was about the covid policies and jabs. A CHILD can be excused, but not adults. It just doesn't work that way.
So there were no victims at Jonestown, at least not adult ones. Brainwashing is not a thing, got it.
Do not put words in my mouth! I said the adults were not victims, because they chose to believe Jones' lies over evidence thereof. Once they got to Guyana, there was the same sort of mass formation psychosis we saw in the USSR,Nazi Germany, and Mao's China, as well as here over the past few yrs, but in all those places here WERE some, subjected to the SAME conditioning and rhetoric, who still saw through it and stood against it. They CHOSE to not heed it, while the rest chose to follow like lemmings. But we are not lemmings: WE have the choice.
Brainwashed people specifically can no longer make choices. Your position is that there were no adult Jonestown victims, they all had choice. I say they did not have choice. I maintain brainwashing and cult programming is a thing, and there but for some luck might be me.
Deprogramming is almost impossible. However as I said we are going in circles.
Godspeed on your path.
There is no "brain washing"; your brains like a computer; you can hit delete, but it's not really gone; neither is the neural pathway in a brain. You can lay in new pathways, but no guarantee the old ones won't crop back up, in fact the probability is that they will, creating cognitive dissonance, a very psychologically uncomfortable situation, that's near impossible to ignore. Propagandizing only creates new pathways, which may, for a time, suppress the old pathways, but that's all. Deprogramming is a bit like trying to convince you that free will trumps the propaganda: 1has to want to let go the new pathways and rediscover the old ones or create different new ones to replace both. That's what psychotherapy is all about. It only works when you want t to, but that's true of propaganda too.